The variables creation during the battle of the fleet

The core content of the space war game is fleet combat. The current fleet battle is simply a numerical battle. The fleet of the two sides does not move in a fixed position, only exchanging unilateral attacks with each other, and the battle ends.

This is a combat system that can only be experienced in mobile games. Also, the lack of variables makes it impossible to overcome numerical inferiority, and there are no scenes like dramas that win by tactics and strategy in unfavorable situations.

For example, a player playing another civilization can only use two or more fleets to take down one ripchee fleet, and nothing else he can do. This means balance breaks and reduced fun. To be honest, the current fleet battles are very boring and unfair.

To overcome this situation, an element of ‘creation of variables’ is needed.

For example…(In the examples below, number one is the prerequisite.)

  1. Movement of ships during fleet combat : I know that the previously existing ‘Movement of ships during fleet combat’ was deleted due to logic problems and bugs. Without this, the battle is boring and do not dynamic, making not want to see the battle scenes. Players can predict the result without even seeing the battle scenes. Movement is also one of numerous strategies and tactics. Therefore, the movement of ships during the battle of the fleet is essential.

  2. Use terrains : For example, if a fleet battle takes place in an asteroid field, ships can avoid an attack if they hide behind an asteroid.

  3. Adding durability to each module, weapon, and engine: Simple damage to the armour and shield can have somewhat obvious consequences. Add durability to each module, weapon, and engine, and if they are subjected to damage beyond endurance, they should be temporarily disabled or able to be destroyed (each module or weapon has been destroyed, but if the ship is still alive, then the upgrade will allow it to be refitted). Also, when manual combat is released in the future, it will require very delicate controls.

  4. Weapons capable of destroying fighters : Currently there are no weapons capable of destroying fighters, so unilateral attacks are possible. The fighters should be capable of being destroyed.

  5. Combat Field Extension : There is a variable creation that can be obtained from this.

5-1. Long Range Weapons: Long range weapons can sniping and kaiting at long distances.

5-2. Short-range Warp : Mounting a short-range warp module would allow it to jump a short distance within the field of battle and punch a counter to a sniper ship equipped with a long-range weapon.

  1. Knock-back weapon : The damage is weak, but when hit, the enemy ship is pushed out of its current position. This may interfere with the maneuver of avoidance or may disrupt the position.

  2. Decreased Movement Speed : If the enemy ship is highly maneuverable, it will be difficult to hit the projectile weapon. However, if it is equipped with a weapon that reduces the speed of movement, the situation will change. It is possible to induce a malfunction in the engine of the enemy ship and then drop a certain percentage of the moving speed.

  3. Assult ship : There must be a dedicated weapon (e.g. a giant saw) and the range must be very short, but the damage must be strong. Attack using a short-range warp would bring the battle to its advantage.

Imagine how dynamic and fun these variables will create battles. Imagine how cool these battles would make the fleet battle video recorded by the players.

@joe , @mel You guys need to look back and see if you don’t care about the most basic things. It’s okay to be late, so please complete basic things first.

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Fully in agreement with all points.

The lack of depth in combat here, will in the long run, be a grave disappointment I feel: unless out of nowhere we get non combat actions that are as fulfilling as the odd fight or so!

My previous thoughts on the subject Here:

I m here from Pre Beta but also heard about other combat system that was here. For now you still have formations, still have decription of missile weapon that it ignore obstacles, i read in Wiki that attacking fleets from behind had the advantage… So in truth the battles for now is most dissapointing thing in game and thanks Avalanche - he expressed my thoughts

But in truth a lot of things @Avalanche said is hard to do on auto battles, i just hope that Devs working on new battle system

I have re linked this before but every time I see posts like these I think a reminder of the BACKWARDS STEPS the game has taken is worth seeing…! Combat is now over simplified to the point that its no longer credible. Right after alliances 1.0 this should be fixed in some way (any way!) Or we will be missing a full third of the game.

The good news is that we already know the game engine is capable of good things! The trick is for our poor old Devs to get time to re-enable the good stuff in such a way it wont break other needed refinements. Still speed the day!

Very interesting video Zathabar. However I’m wondering if it was a matter or scale that caused the devs to scrap a complex battle system. All that you show above has to be calculated, generated, then hosted, while everything else required to run the game continues to cruch away in the background.

There is a big temptation to include the micro and the macro in these space MMO’s. However it takes a lot of processing. Eve supports large scale battles, but these are battle of individual players controlling individual ships. Here we’re talking fleets of individual players being automatically controlled by the servers in real time… The processing load becomes astronomical pretty quickly.

Although a very sweet presentation, I would opt for less dramatic videos in lieu of more depth in ship construction, randomness of damage, and perhaps even an “experience modifier” where a ship’s combat ability is more than a sum of it’s build parameters.

These are easy things to implement and simple to calculate. But I suspect a galaxy wide implementation of the battles you display above is just not practical with thousands of players.

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Honestly that occurred to me to, The failing here really is the inability to EXPLAIN such things. You are probably correct however probably doesn’t cut it with me if the loading was too much simply say so and the issue of this players dissatisfaction largely goes away.

Absolutely! An interesting system will cause a lot of people to use it! This is where in a previous thread having the battle duration being extended could actually help as if you slow the engagement time from the knats eyeblink that our so called battles take now to a few minutes you spread the loading.

Likewise if proper tactical options (retreat on X damage level) etc was implemented things ought o become less protracted over all or at least big engagements could be split into a series of smaller ones.

Finally if battles were properly spaced out into range categories (Long med short etc as again has been speculated) then only the final stage at short range would need to be animated as a climax the exchange of softening up long range fire (like a volley of torpedoes, launching a fighter screen etc) could be skipped in abstract calculation only.

This is Not eve as you say the depth of a players action is going to be limited to a few preset actions so those known “If fire mission A and Defence option B = damage option C” can be approximately calculated when the two fleets are set on an intercept course. Goodness knows we are estimating the effect in our heads and at no point are battles ever going to “suddenly” occur in a game of this pace! (Oh well cloaked fleets may prove an exception admittedly!)

Fully agree. As I said above only the climax might be worth a cinematic. Right now the close in of battle is monstrously unsatisfying compared to what it used to be. But I maintain until they give a valid reason WHY this can no longer done we have to assume the Engine of the game could do it. The question is as you say to shave the unneeded parts of a battle down so as not to overload the server during a war or similar.

Lets leave aside the fact we know we are on reduced server power as its Pre Beta and the Devs have reassured of its scalability etc many times before this. No computer has infinite power to do cosmetic things. But that is exactly it. Battle scenes Are cosmetic if we have no direct way of influencing them in a live manner should we happen to be online when they occur?

Some of the examples I mentioned are possible in manual combat, but I think most of them can be implemented in automatic combat. If fleet battle isn’t fun, people will lose interest. There may be a variety of reasons why players left the Outscape, but I think an uninteresting fleet battle is one of them. It’s a pity that developers don’t seem to care about the most basic and core battle of the fleet. The purpose of playing PVP games is to have fun fighting with other players, but the fleet battle itself is not fun. I just feel like I’m playing a common mobile game.

@joe, @mel Developers need to leave the development of new contents aside for a while and start working with the fleet battle contents immediately. It would be too much for developers to do much right away. What can be done right now is to change the visual effects of weapons in a spectacular. Once you do so, the battle becomes colorful. If the battle is spectacular, even the pleasure of watching will arise. See Stellaris’ fleet battle. Although it is an automatic battle, it is so spectacular that you can watch the battle with pleasure. I hope you can change the visual effects of the weapon and then do something else.

I agree that for now battle content is most weak part of a game. There are a lot of games where battles calculating automaticly and you just see a result of it. But thouse games are boring and deleting by me in a day or two.
Outscape in other hand has a great potential. IMMHO really deep strategy game is the game where you dont use only your calculator, but use different strategys in battle, using sneak attackes from cloacked fleets, use different formations and shipbuilds for a win.
I heard that in Alpha battles was the good part of game and was a different.

So i hope that beta will not be just about new factions or new techs, but about differently other battles