Native Population Riots

I am playing Sintis on atd, which is supposed to be immune to unhappiness. I colonized a planet that has Harpies on it. As I terraformed the planet, the Harpies unhappiness hit 0 and caused the entire planet to riot, including the Sintis (which are supposed to be immune to unhappiness). The Harpies refuse to reduce their population or leave. So I dismantled all of the terraforming. Now the Harpies are still unhappy and causing the entire planet to riot. This in turn makes the planet completely unusable to me, since nobody will ever work again, so I have to abandon it. If the Sintis are immune to unhappiness, then they should be immune regardless of the Harpies happiness. And if the Harpies become unhappy, then their population should drop just like every body else’s population does. This is how it worked in Main2, and it should be how it works in atd.

Syntis alone are immune to unhappiness, however if you colonize one with an organic civ (native or player) you are subject to the same issues that organics have. You must keep the native civ happy. There are EC’s available to syntis to help with this. It works the same in both Main2 and AtD galaxies.

Well this is the first time that I am having this problem. I just moved from Main2 to atd a week ago, so I assumed that the problem was only in atd. But no problem. I will avoid all organic populations from now on while playing Sintis.

Off-Topic (somewhat)

This is a pretty cool mechanic. They should re-use this for invaded planets and have them regularly riot by giving an occupied planet a huge happiness penalty which is long lasting and gets replaced by a bonus if the original owner retakes the planet. Thus liberating it.

Thanks @Lady_Aura for showing me how to use hidden sections :slight_smile:

FWIW, Before deciding to post this as a bug, I posted it elsewhere. In that thread Yamota stated that they think that this is a bug. Reason being, even after building climate and land buildings to make the planet inhospitable to the Harpies, their population would not be reduced. So I guess I don’t understand the comment “Off-Topic (somewhat)”. I may not understand why this happened, but it does appear to be a bug, atleast to some.

If it matters, one other thing that I did different this time around, was that I let the Harpy population reach their max pop before making it inhospitable for them.

Off-topic, which is a collapsed comment, just means that it is not directly related to this alleged bug, hence why I collapsed it. I have not seen any patch-notes saying that secondary factions cannot be killed off by reducing/increasing temp. so I believe this, if reproducible, sounds like a bug.

Are you sure that the temperature is outside of their bracket?

The temperature = 0C, Land Mass = 90%, Unhappiness = -3.
Yes, I’m sure it is outside their hospitable range. If it wasn’t, then they wouldn’t be unhappy.

And thanks for showing me what a hidden section is. I didn’t know that there was such a thing until just now. which is why I commented on what I could see which was just the comment that I quoted.

Please make a separate post elsewhere with this suggestion. BTW I disagree wholeheartedly with it.

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If they are unhappy, then the happiness information will show negative. If it is outside of their temperature/land mass range then the population will show a decline. I’m uncertain which you are experiencing. As I said Syntis have happiness centers to solve the negative happiness, you just have to build them.

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I gave you the land mass and temperature. Those are the only two things that determine their hospitable range. You can easily check it at any planet that has Harpies on it.

And as any population (yours or native) will show you, the controlling variable is always happiness. If the temperature and land make a place inhospitable, the reason the population decreases is that the population becomes unhappy. And if you make the population happy again, it will stop decreasing. My Harpies are very unhappy, and yet are not decreasing.

I addressed the uselessness of the current medical buildings in a different post. So they are not currently a valid solution.

P.S. Any dev that would like to take a look at the current problem, the planet in question is Hapalki E. It currently has the needed 25 medical buildings to make the Harpy happy (at a total cost of 83k population), but eliminating those medical buildings will not cause the Harpy population to reduce.

Is the POPULATION DECREASING? Or is the HAPPINESS decreasing? It is your bug, I can’t answer your situation unless you present a picture. Optimal land mass for Harpy is 40%, so 90% might be too high for them but this has NOTHING to do with happiness. It’s not a bug. You’re having an issue understanding how happiness works.

Screen shot the planet please, along with the happiness screen as it is.

If the population is decreasing, remove some of the hydro stations and get the planet back closer to Harpy’s optimal, all that will do is reduce the syntis growth rate. But that will stop the negative “growth” of the Harpy.

The negative growth of the Harpy may have led to a labor shortage that exceeds the allowable 30%, this will stop your buildings from functioning.

90% land is definitely out of the hospitable range of Harpies. The problem is that even though it is out of the range of the Harpies, the population is not decreasing. And I do understand happiness. And hospitable range definitely affects happiness. And Happiness normally determines whether your population grows or shrinks. If you change the happiness of your race on a planet, you will see your growth rate follow it, and even go negative when your happiness goes negative. That is the way it is supposed to work.

My bug is that it is not working that way for the Harpies on my planet. Their happiness is -3 yet their population is not shrinking.

As for “remove some of the hydro stations and get the planet back closer to Harpy’s optimal, all that will do is reduce the syntis growth rate”, nothing could be more wrong. It not only decreases the growth rate, but it also reduces the maximum population on the planet, and the amount of credits earned. Having the Harpy preferred land mass would reduce max population and credits earned to approximately 1/6, along with the growth rate.

I destroyed some of the medical buildings to give you the screen shots that you asked for. As you will see, they say exactly what I have been saying.

Growth Range for harpys is -8C - +38C which means 0C is within the growth range.

Optimal water balance is 60% which likely means that your parameters are not enough. I have noticed that temperature plays a greater role than land mass so I think you need to decrease the temperature further which I guess Synthis cannot do below 0C so it seems you’re out of luck my friend.

How about a picture of the structures built. Looks like you need about 22 medicine buildings to bring it to zero

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Do you have the government building built up?

As I already told you, it takes 25 medical buildings. I know because I built them.

I am just going around and around. You aren’t believing what I say even when I show it to you. So I will say no more. It is a bug. If not fixed then you are telling everyone to either kill off native population ASAP, or don’t capture a planet that already has population on it. Fix it, or don’t, that is up to you. This is the end of my replies to this thread.

Even Evos keep growing on 90% land mass planets when their temperature is within their growth limits. And they prefer 70% water.

So, Harpies with 60% water preference will happily grow on a 90% land mass planet if it is within their preferred temperature range.

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I haven’t seen the structures and calculated what it says to compare to the medicinal buildings you do have. I guess I’ll let Joe do it. It’s just never been reported and we have a bunch of Syntis veterans playing who could confirm the problem if it were a bug. Possibly yours is an isolated incident. Before medicinal buildings there was no way to keep organics happy - so they were avoided by Syntis.