Fleets And Battle Groups

Fleet battles should be more complex. One way of doing this is to make fleets larger, but not in flagship level, but making fleets be smaller fleets called battle groups.

The idea is to have a fleet able to split up and engage. Right now splitting a fleet isnt a viable combat option. Why waste time splitting your fleet to deal with another, when you can just engage him with the entire fleet?

Battle groups would be fleets within fleets. Each ship still has their flagship level, but a battle group level too, this would be a number similar to warp speeds. Say a 3/8 level would mean your fleet can have up to 3 battle groups, with 8 ships in each group.

Battleships and dreadnoughts would have the highest battle group level. A dread would have the same 18 flag level, but also a 6/10 battle group level. So you can have 6 battle groups with 10 ships each.

You cannot have your entire fleet engage one other fleet. You have to release each battle group to engage. If a enemy engages your entire fleet,

Your battle groups would come first. You can choose in which order the battle groups engage. If a battle group is destroyed by the enemy, another one will engage, i will talk about this more later. I should make this clear, IT SHOULD NOT BE POSSIBLE FOR AN ENEMY TO KNOW WHICH BATTLE GROUPS COME FIRST.

If a group is destroyed by an enemy, the next group will engage. IF they arent fast enough to enter warp. This is a part where i suggest speed values. Say, a battleship group would not be able to run from a frigate group. Or it would be on a ship size basis. Smaller ships will be able to catch bigger ships. So, having a full battleship fleet, a enemy battleship group can engage yours and be able to run away afterward. But, if you have destroyers or frigates in one of your groups, they would be able to catch the battleships and keep their group engaged. A fleet can travel as fast as the slowest ship. Id suggest that a dread would have a speed of 1, battleships 2, destroyers 3, frigates 4, corvettes 5. This is just a basic number but the idea is that a smaller ship can catch a bigger one.

Using this, you could potentially protect important ships in a hot zone. Say ammo ships or bombers.

Let me know what you think.

Should be based on the addition of captains and other variants of leaders though.

Considering the flag number is 18 making a total of 18 ships within that fleet. So the question is with your calculation 6 battle groups of 10 ship’s seems to be a bit way off. As how can you get 60 ship’s into 18. I think you need to rethink your mathematic’s with this plan.

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… did you read the suggestion at all? I said that fleets would have their normal flagship level, but also a battle group level.

Yes I read it. You need to remember a flagship number is the amount of ship’s that can be within that fleet. So again I say how can you get 6 battle groups of 10 ship’s each which is a total of 60 ship’s into a flagship fleet which can only hold 18.

The only way it would work is if those battle groups were using different configurations of ship’s out of those 18 ship’s within the fleet of a flagship 18 fleet.

Plus the other factor is for this to work the fleet formation setup would also have to fall into line with how that subject of fleet formation setup has been being discussed. By allowing players to have pre-saved formation setups.

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Now:
Ships have flagship limits.
Dreads have 18.
That means the fleet can have 1 (dread) + 17 (any ships)

@BigBoomer’s idea:
Ships will have a new battle group stat : A / B
A - number of supported battle groups
B - maximum number of ships in the battle groups

In his example dreads would have 6/10. (6 battle groups of 10 ships.)

So, the dread fleet will still consists of 18 ships but it will have battle groups (mini fleets) escorting it. And, the battle group(s) will fight before the main fleet.

This idea is similar to what @Slamz suggested: Armadas: a Fleet of Fleets.

But, here it seems a fleet with all of its battle groups would only cost a single fleet point. Correct me if I’m wrong @BigBoomer.

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Ok that explanation is quite easier to understand the mechanic’s behind the suggestion. I have no further complaint to the idea. With the explanation put this way others will also see the potential of the idea.

The Battle Group idea here would benefit and add to the strategic part to combat involvement of the game. Plus add an exciting part to combat due to not knowing what you may come up against. Even tho you may not be able to see what the combat groups are you should be allowed to see what ship’s are within the entire fleet. Only exception would be cloaked battlegroup’s. Which you would only see if they were in sensor range of a decloaker ship.

Which was perfectly explained in the original post and it went right over his head.

One the way Lady_Aura put it was much more explainatory compared to your explaination. Another thing guess you don’t read rules on posting either. With your flamatory remark aimed directly at another player. Which was it really needed to be posted.

If a player makes a comment about your post that they aren’t quite grasping your point. Take the time to explain it another way. Don’t be arrogant and rude because they don’t quite understand where your trying to go with your idea.

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Oh wow, you talk about rules when i know alot of people who do worse and you never say anything to them. Lady said basically what i said, i simply dont get how it was so hard to understand. I said they had the same 18 ship flag, but ALSO a 6/10 battle group level, so 6 battle groups with 10 ships. The only way i can see where people shouldnt understand is that they didnt even read the post. Like i said Lady basically said exactly what i said in the original post. Something seems fishy.

The way Lady pointed it out was simpler to understand and couldn’t in any way be misread. have another read of what you just said, Same 18 flag ship Also a 6/10 battleship group level.
When reading it it was the word (same) was taken that the original 18 flag was in place which gave the meaning that the fleet would only contain the flag ship level amount of ship’s. Then the word (Also) gave the impression that you were implying that the battle group was part of the flag ship number. Which in Lady’s post was explained that it was apart from the flagship number. I’m sorry if you didn’t want to take the time to explain it and shrug the comment off as if it had no reason in being posted. There’s no problem with your idea. It has a valued point and add to the strategy of combat. Which is great. Makes combat more complex tactically.

So please at some point add to your idea as you said you would. Simplify the explaination try not to make it too complex with wording that can be miscontrued in what you are actually trying to explain. This was achieved by Lady’s way by breaking down the wording into a way that couldn’t in any way be misconstrued to be any other meaning then what it stated.

I still dont get how it was so complicated. Using the word “also” is you adding something to something. So, i ADDED the 6/10 level to the existing 18 flag level. This just seems like a petty attempt to troll me. People simply ignore certain points in a post simply to argue with me about them.

I’m not trolling you I am explaining the way I saw it has nothing to do with you personally. You could have said it like : Also has a 6/10 battle group value which is seperate component to the actual flagship number. Battle groups are a form of creating armarda style fleets. Allowing players to create more complex fleet combinations without having to try to split fleets in a battle situation. As to do so in it’s current form is just impossible.

I have also in the past be told similar things about the way I had explained thing’s.

Since i cant quote,

“Battle groups would be fleets within fleets. Each ship still has their flagship level, but a battle group level too”

@BigBoomer you must have deleted/otherwise removed the opening [

Ok but will a player have to have the formation of the fleets setup before combining the battle groups to the flag ship fleet. As for this to work I see they’ll have to uphgrade the formation setup situation to where we have saved formation setup’s.

Boomer, your post was confusing as hell. So someone, after reading it, called you out for it. You reacted like a child, as you do.

Someone else came along and translated your concept into English, which more people could understand. And you attacked them, too.

You should have just said “Thank you”.

I’ve seen worse ideas, but the Armada concept has been presented before, and it was quoted by Lady_Aura above.

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No it wasnt. You only think it is just so you can be against me. Ive met people like you before, who would do anything to simply argue with me about something, no matter how stupid you look in the process. Here you are yet again, trolling. My post was not confusing. And no i didnt attack lady, you can see i liked her post, because one of your goons ignored my points to start an argument. @joe why do you accept this behavior? I think the community would be a better place if he were finally banned. You may call me a child, but im not the one who dedicates his life to trolling people on a space ship game. Think about that for a moment, and no matter what you say, you look like the idiot here. I made a suggestion and one of your goons manipulated and twisted my points to argue with me. All i did was say my part. I dont think i acted like a child, if anything its you. Hiring people to start fights with me. Like i said, you only think its confusing because the point is against me. Lady got exactly what i was saying, easily. So, if it really is confusing, then maybe thats a problem on your end.

Accusations that I was hired to do it. I am afraid you are way of the mark.

Anyway I am not against your idea in any way. I never shot the idea down completely in any way shape or form. But was after a explaination to my question. Which you shot down by saying didn’t you read the post. Instead of explaining it.

In all parts you still haven’t gotten round to explaining other game functions that will be effected by you idea and how they should also be changed to implement the idea without leaving a hole in the implementation to where a situation or problem may arise from it’s implementation.

Of which you need to think about the formation setup of these battlegroups. As I stated without presaved formation setups the idea of battle groups compound the problem with fleet formation.

Right. Someone who actually wants to discuss.

I think the formations of the battle groups would not be centered around a flagship. Each ship in the battle groups can be place anywhere in the circle, since the flagship is still in the main group. Id say placement would be in a circle around the main fleet. Like, when you zoom into a fleet, you click on the ship, and you get the main fleets cirlce, plus 6 other fleet circles (for dreadnought flagships). In the fleet management you can drag and drop from a list of every group in the fleet. Going from top to bottom, this will be the order in which group engages first when being attacked. It should not be possible for an enemy to know which group comes first. Using this, itd probably be good to reduce fleet cap, since we can then have 78 ships in a fleet using the numbers above. I think a corvette under cloak should be able to target a specific group, that is if there are no cloak detectors active, similar to the attacking from behind mechanic. I think a corvette in a battle group should be able to use modules, if using cloaking modules, it will appear that the battle group that the corvette is in, isnt there. This would allow say someone attacks you, and is prepared for all of your groups, they wont see the cloaked corvette group so it will surprise him, and he likely wont be ready for whatever the corvette was cloaking. It should be so that a well thought out fleet can be ready to deal with most if not all situations.